Thank you for a fascinating article, I have learnt a lot and look forward to your article about Catholicism. I am thinking of seeking sanctuary from modern Anglicanism in the RC church.
Spot-on Fr. Calvin! I've been attempting to present the very same facts to a number of Roman Catholics I know, and the replies I get are just short of diabolical. We who have fully vetted the history of the Church IN Brittania, know that they predated the Church OF England, and, in fact, predated the Church of Rome. After all, we do see the bishops of England at the Council of Nicaea long before the Roman Catholic Church took over leadership of the the Church in England.
As someone who, with my church, gradually separated from the Episcopal Church after the ordination of Gene Robinson as bishop in 2003, I’ve had way too much experience of separation in the Church. We aligned with the African Anglican Church (Nigeria, if I’m remembering correctly) and eventually became part of a diocese in the Anglican Church in North America. But communion with heretics continues to be a problem, now that the Archbishop of Canterbury seems to be supporting the blessing of homosexual relationships.
But wasn’t the early church constantly battling over heretical departures from Christian doctrine? There was Gnosticism, Pelagianism, Arminianism, and no doubt many others. It seems the battle for the true faith will not end until Christ returns and all things are put under His feet. In the meantime, I’m thankful for you and the others whose devotion to truth and facts and history keep the rest of us grounded.
I am glad that you are defending the catholicity of the Anglican Church because that is a door into acknowledging the catholicity of the Reformed church in Scotland (Presbyterian), in the Netherlands, in France, etc. I come from the Dutch Reformed tradition which speaks of the catholic nature of the church and the apostolicity of her doctrine. If you look at the historical background of the Synod Dort (which produced the Canons of Dort) in Dordtrecht, Netherlands, there were a variety of Anglican representatives there, who also played a role in formulating Reformed doctrine in contradiction to the errors of Jacobus ARminius. If you read the intent of many of the Reformers they saw these various national churches as an expression of the catholic faith against the charges of schism by Rome.
Thank you for your insights on this. Not all Roman Catholics have such a binary view of Henry VIII. Sadly I believe you are right that the matter of his annulment was decided on the basis of politics rather than the basis of prudence and wisdom that the Holy Father should have considered. I was shocked when in college, my professor (a fellow proud Roman Catholic) defended Henry VIII regarding his treatment by Rome! I was very surprised to learn so much about this period in history of which I was ignorant.
I hope we can one day see greater unification between England and Rome, and a renewed reverence and protection for the many sacred Cathedrals and Monasteries that have shaped the character and spirituality of your country for centuries. I look forward to seeing your thoughts about Catholicism in your forthcoming article.
Well done, Father Calvin! Your command of history and theological matters is very instructive. I especially like to hear you and Laurence Fox debate on "Fox and Father." Yours is the voice of reason and firm conviction.
Thankyou Calvin for this article it has helped fill in a lot of factual gaps. I'm only a novice in these matters, but it would be interesting to explore how these same chronological facts might be interpreted with more nuance through the lens of the Sensus fidei (Lumen Gentium 12; CCC 92) over the period. Perhaps at grass roots level the imaginative draw and sacramental experience of being part of the mystical body of Christ; each person a uniquely colourful character in the 'Christian Story', was 'heavily edited' as a result of the events you outline, and the gaps filled by rhetoric and black and white thinking, leading to the continued polarisation we still see today, even in parts of this thread. Sorry if this doesn't make much sense.. I'm still trying to understand what it is I'm trying to say :)
Great essay. I would have liked a mention of St Alban, the powerful Pelagians who some scholars see as a sign of independence and the still-extant Romano-Briton church protected from invaders by St Germanus of Auxerre.
I cannot thank you enough for this text. I think it is going to teach me so so much, it is wonderful. Lots for a person like me to learn and this is magistral.
I rarely disagree with you but must comment today. These rules are all man made. None of them should replace the clear, unequivocal rules in the Bible, dictated by God himself. We are neither catholic nor protestant - we are followers of Jesus, and all these rules and precepts merely muddy the waters. When the church split from the original jewish body of believers it seems to have felt it must reinvent the wheel. Celibacy was not ordered by God, in fact the very opposite. All of the rules on ‘both sides’ are merely the attempt of humans to replace God’s own rules, so will fail and cause only division. Return to the roots and there you will find no catholic or anglican, no jew or greek, no bondsman or free. Only sheep and a shepherd. Since when did the sheep dictate terms to the shepherd, and to what end and at what cost?
A looting operation start to finish. Henry had sons he could have legitimatized there were absolutely no theological issues in play here. One result the extrajudicial murder of over 72k English citizens and the devastating rupture of a once cohesive society. This also made a resolution of the Irish problem impossible.
Thank you for a fascinating article, I have learnt a lot and look forward to your article about Catholicism. I am thinking of seeking sanctuary from modern Anglicanism in the RC church.
Spot-on Fr. Calvin! I've been attempting to present the very same facts to a number of Roman Catholics I know, and the replies I get are just short of diabolical. We who have fully vetted the history of the Church IN Brittania, know that they predated the Church OF England, and, in fact, predated the Church of Rome. After all, we do see the bishops of England at the Council of Nicaea long before the Roman Catholic Church took over leadership of the the Church in England.
Thank you for this.
As someone who, with my church, gradually separated from the Episcopal Church after the ordination of Gene Robinson as bishop in 2003, I’ve had way too much experience of separation in the Church. We aligned with the African Anglican Church (Nigeria, if I’m remembering correctly) and eventually became part of a diocese in the Anglican Church in North America. But communion with heretics continues to be a problem, now that the Archbishop of Canterbury seems to be supporting the blessing of homosexual relationships.
But wasn’t the early church constantly battling over heretical departures from Christian doctrine? There was Gnosticism, Pelagianism, Arminianism, and no doubt many others. It seems the battle for the true faith will not end until Christ returns and all things are put under His feet. In the meantime, I’m thankful for you and the others whose devotion to truth and facts and history keep the rest of us grounded.
Fascinating read. Thank you for sharing!
I am glad that you are defending the catholicity of the Anglican Church because that is a door into acknowledging the catholicity of the Reformed church in Scotland (Presbyterian), in the Netherlands, in France, etc. I come from the Dutch Reformed tradition which speaks of the catholic nature of the church and the apostolicity of her doctrine. If you look at the historical background of the Synod Dort (which produced the Canons of Dort) in Dordtrecht, Netherlands, there were a variety of Anglican representatives there, who also played a role in formulating Reformed doctrine in contradiction to the errors of Jacobus ARminius. If you read the intent of many of the Reformers they saw these various national churches as an expression of the catholic faith against the charges of schism by Rome.
Thank you for your insights on this. Not all Roman Catholics have such a binary view of Henry VIII. Sadly I believe you are right that the matter of his annulment was decided on the basis of politics rather than the basis of prudence and wisdom that the Holy Father should have considered. I was shocked when in college, my professor (a fellow proud Roman Catholic) defended Henry VIII regarding his treatment by Rome! I was very surprised to learn so much about this period in history of which I was ignorant.
I hope we can one day see greater unification between England and Rome, and a renewed reverence and protection for the many sacred Cathedrals and Monasteries that have shaped the character and spirituality of your country for centuries. I look forward to seeing your thoughts about Catholicism in your forthcoming article.
Thanks for reminding us of history some would like us to forget.
Off topic, I hope you post your address at the upcoming Colson conference. I have so many travels, I don't think it doable for me to be there.
Well done, Father Calvin! Your command of history and theological matters is very instructive. I especially like to hear you and Laurence Fox debate on "Fox and Father." Yours is the voice of reason and firm conviction.
Thank you for the article. Very insightful and encouraging.
Great article, I look forward to your next one about Catholicism.
Thankyou Calvin for this article it has helped fill in a lot of factual gaps. I'm only a novice in these matters, but it would be interesting to explore how these same chronological facts might be interpreted with more nuance through the lens of the Sensus fidei (Lumen Gentium 12; CCC 92) over the period. Perhaps at grass roots level the imaginative draw and sacramental experience of being part of the mystical body of Christ; each person a uniquely colourful character in the 'Christian Story', was 'heavily edited' as a result of the events you outline, and the gaps filled by rhetoric and black and white thinking, leading to the continued polarisation we still see today, even in parts of this thread. Sorry if this doesn't make much sense.. I'm still trying to understand what it is I'm trying to say :)
Great article Calvin. I really only knew a brief history of this from school. It's good to know our common roots in our mother church.
Great essay. I would have liked a mention of St Alban, the powerful Pelagians who some scholars see as a sign of independence and the still-extant Romano-Briton church protected from invaders by St Germanus of Auxerre.
I cannot thank you enough for this text. I think it is going to teach me so so much, it is wonderful. Lots for a person like me to learn and this is magistral.
I rarely disagree with you but must comment today. These rules are all man made. None of them should replace the clear, unequivocal rules in the Bible, dictated by God himself. We are neither catholic nor protestant - we are followers of Jesus, and all these rules and precepts merely muddy the waters. When the church split from the original jewish body of believers it seems to have felt it must reinvent the wheel. Celibacy was not ordered by God, in fact the very opposite. All of the rules on ‘both sides’ are merely the attempt of humans to replace God’s own rules, so will fail and cause only division. Return to the roots and there you will find no catholic or anglican, no jew or greek, no bondsman or free. Only sheep and a shepherd. Since when did the sheep dictate terms to the shepherd, and to what end and at what cost?
A looting operation start to finish. Henry had sons he could have legitimatized there were absolutely no theological issues in play here. One result the extrajudicial murder of over 72k English citizens and the devastating rupture of a once cohesive society. This also made a resolution of the Irish problem impossible.